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TOPIC: bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things

bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 6 months ago #12503

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A finale that does TNG justice?
Let us know your opinions/ memories.

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Religion is a bit like knitting; basically good but responsible for some very bad things.
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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 6 months ago #12504

I haven't quite caught up with the podcast yet but I'd like to feedback on this one, could you tell me when the deadline is for MP3s?

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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 6 months ago #12505

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We're recording the evening of Thur 4th Feb.
Would be great to hear from you :)
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Religion is a bit like knitting; basically good but responsible for some very bad things.
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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 5 months ago #12506

All Good Things...

Firstly thankyou for doing the podcast.

All Good Things...it aired in the US on 5/23/1994 and I saw it on video shortly after and for the 20 after it's stuck with me this one thing above all...

"You just don't get it, do you, Jean-Luc? The trial never ends. We wanted to see if you had the ability to expand your mind and your horizons, and for one brief moment, you did. For that one fraction of a second, you were open to options you had never considered. That is the exploration that awaits you. Not mapping stars and studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of existence." — Q

and with that starburst the light that was the hopeful Star Trek passed... DS9 would be good but it would never be as hopeful

And it's kind of odd and miraculous — given the overall weakness (I am being nice) of the seventh season, where creatively the show was sputtering on fumes, and where Moore and Braga had just finished writing a feature film alongside their existing TV duties, and given the constraints required of this particular finale — that "All Good Things..." somehow managed not only to work, but to be not just the best Star Trek series finale made but it may just be star trek at it's most Trek...

"Tapestry" which is a brilliant prelude to "All Good Things…" Only Picard sees and interacts with Q in these last two installments. Q is trying to help Picard see things differently and to change his destiny -first on a personal level ("Tapestry") and then on a major cosmic level ("All Good Things…") if "Tapestry" was the practice quiz; then "All Good Things…" was the final exam.

In terms of pure fun, the scenes in the future are the episode's most enjoyable because they give us entertaining glimpses of a possible future for all the characters as Picard embarks on the classic storytelling mission of getting the band back together for one last concert tour. It's like doing the years-later reunion show before the show actually end. It's amusing to see versions of all the characters who are grumpier and more crotchety, particularly Patrick Stewart's take on the old and defensive Picard,

The story's notion of future Data is pretty much perfect. Data as a professor at Cambridge, with very bad artificial streak of gray hair and a snarky housekeeper named Jessel who tells him how ridiculous it looks, is laid-back comedy gold that feels like the right epilogue for this character (and far more so than the hollowly unfortunate one we got in that film).

To change gears which the episode itself does frequently and without warning, there's also the matter of Picard's transitions into the past timeline circa "Encounter at Farpoint," where he is first arriving on the Enterprise as its captain via a shuttle being piloted by Yar. These scenes also contain nods for longtime fans, like the inclusion of O'Brien in a red uniform, and the more magnified, inquisitive personality of Data and boy did that mellow significantly after the first season.

And somewhere within this timejump mess lies the brilliance of "All Good Things"; it has all of these character touches and details for the fans but they never get in the way of the intricately plotted story being told. Indeed, in many cases, they are in service of that plot, involving the mysterious spatial anomaly forming in the Devron system in the Romulan neutral zone. This anomaly is first established in the present timeline, and Picard uses this knowledge to investigate the possibility of its connection in the other two timelines.

But Picard still isn't able to solve the mystery, particularly since the anomaly doesn't exist in the future, and for some reason is much larger in the past than in the present. This is where Q provides the large and revelatory hint that for my money provides the most intriguing scene in the episode. He takes Picard eons into the past on Earth, where life is about to begin in the primordial soup. But in this past the anomaly has grown so large that it occupies the entire Alpha Quadrant. This scene is simultaneously haunting and funny: Q walks Picard to the very moment life is supposed to begin on Earth, but instead: "Oh! Nothing happened. See what you've done?" This sort of larger-than-life concept is on a scale that TNG tended to avoid most of its run, but it pays off here. And especially as filtered through Q's cynical detachment, the tone of the scene feels right.

Ultimately, the Devron system sci-fi anomaly at the center of "All Good Things" is in the very typical vein of absurd TNG technobabble (and, make no mistake, this episode doesn't scrimp on the bullshit jargon), but the details are so well thought-out, the stakes are so elevated, and the plot services character so well that all the technobabble works in spite of its arbitrary nature. And there's still a definite gee-whiz factor in the plot converging across three time periods.

I've said in the past that the distilled essence of a lot of TNG — if you put aside all the usual Roddenberry tropes of an evolved, peaceful human philosophy of seeking out new life, etc. — is about telling stories that show in detail its characters' methodical process of solving technical problems. "All Good Things" is like an embodiment of that notion. Here is the ultimate technical brain buster for Picard: Figure out what's happening in the Devron system and why and how it all connects through the three time periods.

Picard and Q have a closing discussion that's THE classic examination of Star Trek themes — but in a decidedly TNG way, where the themes emphasize thinking that goes beyond our idea of linear existence rather than the more TOS-like humanistic philosophical ideas. Really, "All Good Things" works so well not simply for all the reasons I've already mentioned but because it's simply the right ending for this series. Earlier in the episode the writers had Q mocking Picard for spending so much time on trivial matters like Data's quest for humanity or Riker's career aspirations, rather than more important things like stretching the boundaries of conventional thinking when it comes to the very nature of existence.

In some ways, THIS and best of both world are the reason that I consider TNG a great series.

and Over the last couple of decades, I've wished that the last we saw of Picard and Co. was at that poker table in Riker's quarters going out on top. They sure as hell deserved better than those movies...








Still, Season Seven is not a bad season. It not bad with a few notable storys it's pure fucking shite.




Star trek TNG as a whole when it's to a moral code to live by... Hell Star trek TNG has done more for me than most religions.
while still proving some of the best story's and entertainment of my teenage years

Q Who?, The Pegasus, The Drumhead, The Best of Both Worlds 1 and 2, The Wounded and the Measure of a man If I ever want to test a show I ask will have 7 hours as good and Meaningful as that in 7 years.

Very few have very few will.
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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 5 months ago #12507

So thanks Peter and Anne Marie and the rest of the feedbackers

can't wait for your view on the 3 nacelled future "D"?
(I don't hate it)
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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 5 months ago #12536

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The Wesley Monkey suits you Mark ;)
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Religion is a bit like knitting; basically good but responsible for some very bad things.
Milton Jones

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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 5 months ago #12545

Right, I'm going to have another crack at watching All Good Things this afternoon. I had better be worth it, Organ. IT HAD BETTER BE WORTH IT.

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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 5 months ago #12546

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It's an experience- which is all I'm saying this side of recording.

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Religion is a bit like knitting; basically good but responsible for some very bad things.
Milton Jones

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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 5 months ago #12549

For those, like me, who like this sort of thing... the last page of the last script for Star Trek The Next Generation.



End of act ten

End of episode

End of season

End of show
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bOrgCast 7.26- All Good Things 1 year 5 months ago #12550

Hi Orgs,
Finally, I've managed to find time to get some feedback to you. It's only taken the entire run of The Next Generation to do it!
An apology if this comes over very choppy.

My thoughts on All Good Things.

For a series finale, it does its job providing a story that keeps your interest until the end credits
there have been quite a few tv shows that have followed TNG which have failed miserably (Lost we're looking at you!)
Having the episode come full circle with Q's Trial on Humanity being catalyst to the story was inspired, with Q stating that "The trial never ends"
So various plot points that caught my attention during the episode.
The Worf/Deanna relationship should never have happened in the series, was it elevated here, just to get the grudge between Riker and Worf in the future timeline?
Geordi finally gets the girl in the future, married to Leah Brahms.
It was good to get Denise Crosby and Colm Meaney back to guest star, though weird seeing O'Brian in Red, allowing the Past timeline some identifiable faces for the audience to relate to, due to most of the crew being at Farpoint.
The boarding ceremony proves good ol Jean-Luc is a bit more of a traditionalist than Kirk and Spock, with the use of an authentic bosun’s call, instead of the electrical one that was used in Star Trek II.

Data's housekeeper in the future, wasn't she the same lady who was the landlady in Time's Arrow?
Future Data must of put his emotion chip in this future timeline as well, definity more emotional and using contradictions.
Most of the problems I have are in the future timeline, Warp 13? Have they restructured the Warp scale in the future? Have they solved the problem with Subspace as mentioned in Forces of Nature?
There's a bit of a cock-up with regards to Data's investigation of the Tachyon Pulses stating that all three came from the Enterprise, when the future one came from the Pasteur. Whoops!
The Enterprise D with Three nacelles and bloody big phaser cannon does look pretty cool, but would an extra nacelle improve ship's flight?
Why does Future Picard not mention Q to the future crew at any point, it might have made them believe his story slightly.

Did they kill off Deanna because there was no good way to age Marina Sirtis?

The revealing threat of the human race being affected at the moment of their creation is very similar to the Doctor Who Story City of Death, with the villain also in various time periods at the same time.

Couple of nice nods, The USS Yorktown name checked, as we all know the original name that was going to be given to the Enterprise.
Earl Grey Tea, not programmed into the database (though if my Captain was coming onboard, I would have made sure his favourite tipple was programmed long before he arrived!)
For some reason, one of my favourite lines is from Q "You Obtuse piece of Flotsam" don’t know why, but it’s stuck with me.
It’s a shame we only get to see the three Enterprise's together through the view screen, it would have made a great shot with all three together.

One last nitty gritty observation. If the anomaly is Anti-Time going backwards, then surely the USS Pasteur should have encountered it, and should have disappeared when the Pasteur blew up. But thats me being picky
The Final scene with Picard sitting down with the senior staff was a nice way to end, with the Enterprise heading off into the sunset

Overall an enjoyable but Wibbly Wobbly Timey Wimey (Sorry Wrong Franchise) episode.

Finally huge thanks to both Peter and Ann-Marie for hosting this podcast, despite not being able to leave feedback, have been listening in from the start. Helped on those many nights away from home with no internet.

looking forward to 5 more seasons of Deep Space Nine podcast episodes

Cheers
Dave (AKA Good Ash)
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